Episode Transcript
[00:00:01] You're listening to a live recording from Westside Church in Bend, Oregon. Thanks for joining us.
[00:00:06] Everybody that I talk to, churched or not churched, want a better life.
[00:00:14] There's this innate dissatisfaction with life. There's beauty, yes. But then there's always a sense of, like, it could be better, it could be more, it could be different than what it is. And in revelation 21, a guy named John who had a vision from God about the future world, he describes this kind of new way, a new thing that I want to read. And so verse one, chapter 21, then I saw John writes a new heaven and a new earth. Say new, new. I love new stuff. For the first heaven and the first earth had passed away, and there was no longer any sea. I don't know why that's important. I mean, I like water. Pastor Bo Stern Brady, who used to be on staff here, she hates water. So she loves this picture of the new, new heaven and new earth without any sea. I saw the holy city and the new Jerusalem coming down out of heaven from God, prepared. Listen to this. As a bride beautifully dressed for her husband. There's this picture of just. And other authors in the Bible use this kind of metaphor for the church, like a bride prepared for her wedding day. Just beautiful. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, look, God's dwelling place is now among the people.
[00:01:30] He's echoing back to the start of human history, where God created Adam and Eve and walked among them and dwelt with them.
[00:01:39] And God is saying that there's a day coming when we're going to restore everything back to its original design, the way that God intended for life to look like and to be like, which means his dwelling place is now among the people, and he will dwell with them. They will be his people, and God himself will be with them and be their God. By the way, it's not about religion, about relationship with God, our creator, who made us. He will wipe every tear from their eyes.
[00:02:07] No more sadness, no more tears. There will be no more death, nor mourning or crying or pain. For the old order of things has passed away. The old order, the way things have been running and are currently running, will be passed away. It will go away, and there will be a new thing. He who is seated on the throne said, I am making everything new, say new.
[00:02:32] By the way, he's not making new things.
[00:02:35] He's making old things new.
[00:02:38] Old ways, old patterns, old system. He's going to create something. He's going to make those things new. He's going to use what has already been created, that he's already made you and me and make it more beautiful. And he said, write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true. So, Lord, as we open up your word today, would you show us what you want us to see? Help us to hear your voice. Help us to walk according to your word. And for those, Lord, that are in the room and watching online, that have yet to embrace your way, Lord, I pray that they would see and hear maybe something fresh and new about this religion called Christianity, that they would even open their hearts, Lord, to hear something fresh about who you are and what your people are about. I pray in Jesus name. Amen. So God is making all things new. So he started that, and he is doing that. And that's something that this series is about. Is this conversation around. We're framing this dialogue around the epic story of what God is doing, that God created humanity in his image. Every single person on the planet is made in the image of God. They're just. They have this innate value because of being made in the image of God. And then humanity falls into sin. Pastor Ben talked about that last week. Right. And we end up separated from. From God. And then God spends the rest of the narrative, including the day that we live in now, making all things right, redeeming what was lost because of humanity's fall. And it's through this story, this epic narrative, that christians kind of find.
[00:04:21] They make sense of their lives. They find themselves in their own stories within that epic narrative. And so we framed this conversation around three big questions. And so, first question was, why do we read the Bible? Does sin really matter? And by the way, I listened to both messages. I wasn't able to be here on either of those weeks. And can I just say, Ben and Evan brought it. I mean. I mean, yeah, absolutely. Yeah.
[00:04:46] And I was gonna make a joke, but I'm not gonna do that, because I was gonna say, they always bring it. That's what I'm gonna say.
[00:04:54] And we were talking this last week. We met on Tuesday, and we were laughing because Ben and Evan said, steve, we brought it. You better step up your game. That's what they told me. They better step up your game.
[00:05:08] So today's question, does Christianity hurt or heal the world?
[00:05:12] There's an australian sociologist named John Carroll who. He doesn't profess to be a Christian, but it's interesting. He believes that the reason that the church, especially in the west, is in trouble is because it has forgotten its own story.
[00:05:31] He looked at Christianity and like, I think they've forgotten their own story.
[00:05:36] And that's part of our story, is this idea that Adam and Eve sinned. And then we see this devastating change over creation that exists today and culminated in this. In the story with Cain killing his brother Abel. And we realize that we now have, humans now have terrible capacity to lose our way. And we take all that God made, and it's beautiful and was meant for good, and we turn it to evil, and we turn it and abuse it and wound it, including one another. And then we hit Genesis, chapter twelve in the narrative, and we see a glimpse of what God intends to do and what he is doing right now, what he's working towards. And it's called the call to Abram. And it's the story of how God calls Abraham into this new way. And the Lord said to Abram in verse one, go from your country, your people, and your father's household to the land. I will show you. So right there, it shows that God intends for his people to be missionary people.
[00:06:37] What I mean by that is that he's constantly sending his people into unknown territories, into unknown places, into unknown relationships that are not comfortable. Abraham went to a land that he did not know. He didn't understand the language. It was all very new. And God was going to use him in that space. For what? Listen, it says, I will make you into a great nation, and I will bless you. And we all say, amen. Thank you for that. I'm all into prosperity, but there's a purpose for it that we often forget. And I will make your name great. And what? You will be a blessing. God is saying, I want to bless you so you can be a blessing. In other words, I don't. He's not interested in blessing for blessings sake. He's interested in blessing his people so that they will be a blessing to those around them, those that don't know him, those that are far from him, those that are unfamiliar with him. He says, God. God says, I want to bless you. Bless the humanity through you. I will bless those who bless you. And whoever curses you, I will curse. And all peoples on earth say, all of. All peoples, everyone. There's nobody left out of this potential. Blessing will be blessed through you. That is God's heart for humanity. And he wants to be us to be a blessing. He wants to bless the earth through you and me. So much of the Old Testament then, as you continue through the narrative, reveals that God's intention is to bless constantly. He is wanting to.
[00:08:07] To hold back his anger and he's like, I don't want, I don't want to do this. I don't want to hurt people. I don't want to, I want to bless people, I want to dwell with people. He constantly is talking about this. But then it also shows in the Old Testament Israel's inability to be a conduit of that blessing. We see this with the ten Commandments. If you know anything about the ten Commandments, there are ten commandments that show you how to live. And a lot of times, especially, we've taken these in the religious context and we've made it sound like this is the way to get God's favor.
[00:08:46] But that's not why they were written. They were written for our good.
[00:08:52] They were written so that we would have a flourishing life. So when one of the commandments is do not steal, it's not so that God is good with me, that he's happy with me because I'm not a thief.
[00:09:05] It's just simply not good for my neighbor to take stuff from them.
[00:09:10] That's how simple it is. It's not good to commit adultery, not because God will be mad at me, but because it's not good for society, for us to have this rampant adultery happening. It's like, it's just not good for you. It's not going to go well for you. It's not going to be a happy place to live and see. Even the Ten Commandments were about flourishing.
[00:09:34] And I want you to live this way so that you can be a blessing to others.
[00:09:41] I want you to have a different ethic that isn't so that God is happy with you. And if you disobey him, then he's not happy with you. It has anything to do with that. God loves you. I mean, we already heard the message today from the little kid that was at camp. God loves me, God loves you, that's all. But there is this, like, how do I be a blessing to the world around me?
[00:10:06] But they couldn't do it, right? Nor can we. We can't follow the Ten Commandments. I mean, I haven't killed anybody, but I have coveted my neighbor's stuff.
[00:10:18] And Jesus has said later, he said, if you lust after a woman, then you've committed adultery in your heart.
[00:10:26] And that's when everybody gets really quiet in their right, so we can't live up to it, right? So that's a reality, right? None of us could do it. And why? Because sin reigns in us. Because we are people of flesh.
[00:10:40] And what Paul says, what I want to do, I don't do. And that which I don't want to do, I do.
[00:10:48] There's a lot of do doing that. I'm sorry. That was such a stupid joke. I can't help myself. So old.
[00:10:55] But there's this tension we live in.
[00:10:59] But I. As I look at the landscape of the body of Christ, especially in the United States, I am dissatisfied with the answer that, well, we're just sinners, and there's nothing we can do about it.
[00:11:16] And I feel called to. To call myself and the body of Christ to something higher, something better, something good, something that will bring flourishing and healing to our world. So really, the question is not, does Christianity bring hurt or healing? Do Christians bring hurt or healing to the world? And then Jesus came. He came to set things right. He came. And what's amazing about Jesus is he embodies the answer to that question.
[00:11:48] How do Christians bring healing to the world?
[00:11:52] The only place we need to look at is Jesus to discover how does humanity bring. He put on flesh. God came on a rescue mission to help us know how to live, how to help this world be more beautiful. And we live in this now and not yet. Reality. Do you guys know this is a deep theological truth, that. That we know that one day God is going to redeem all things? Revelation 21, all things will be new. Okay, this is not yet.
[00:12:27] We don't experience this to the fullness, but there is some now to it. There is some reality that God is doing that now. And we see that through the person of Jesus. He shows us the way by what he said, by what he taught, by what he did. I mean, when Jesus launches into the scene in Matthew, chapter five, with this grand sermon called Sermon on the Mount, and he starts with what's called the beatitudes, blessed are the poor in spirit. And you're just thinking like, did I hear that right?
[00:12:58] Blessed are the poor in spirit, those who have this softness of heart and this humility about them. Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. That's who gets the kingdom of heaven are people who walk humility. Blessed are those who mourn.
[00:13:14] What?
[00:13:16] Blessed. Just Abraham. I will bless you so you can be a blessing.
[00:13:23] This. I mean, this will just, like, mess with you. I will bless you with grief so that you can be a blessing of comfort to all others who mourn.
[00:13:35] That's what Jesus is saying.
[00:13:38] Blessed are the meek, you know, this inner strength that shows itself and how we lay our lives down for other people. Blessed are the meek for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. I mean, there's just this. What's blessed are the meek.
[00:13:54] What is it?
[00:13:56] I memorized this. What's that? They will inherit the earth. He just goes on and on in this, and then he gets to Matthew, chapter five, where he's a little bit later in this teaching that comes up, and this is like, oh, it's so hard. And we just don't like it at all. You're not going to like this part. And we don't. We don't. We just. It just feels so unjust.
[00:14:18] You know, I'm about to read, but this is the way.
[00:14:22] This is the way that Jesus is describing, how we bring beauty into the world, how we help bring redemption, how we. How we play a part in his plan for the salvation of humanity, how to save humanity from ourselves. This is the way in which you do it.
[00:14:42] Yes. Mourning poor in spirit, pure in heart. Blessed are even those who are persecuted. Right. All of that. But then he goes and he says this. You have heard that it was said, eye for an eye and tooth for tooth. He's beckoning, calling back to even the law of Moses Hammurabi's code. There's this idea that you get what you deserve. If you take something, we're going to take something from you.
[00:15:11] If you steal, we get the hand.
[00:15:15] That's what they did.
[00:15:17] And this idea that if you look lustfully at somebody, we're going to take your eye out. This is like, whoa. Eye for eye, tooth for tooth. But Jesus is saying, you've heard that this is a system, right? It's an old system. But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them, the other cheek also. So hard. If anyone wants to sue you and take your shirt, hand over your coat as well. If anyone forces you to go 1 mile, go with them, too. Give to the one who asks you. Do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. You have heard that it was said, love your neighbor and hate your enemy. But I tell you, love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you, that you may be children of your father in heaven.
[00:16:06] If you want to look like your father in heaven, if you want to, if you want to be part of his, if you want to be participants in the redemption of the world that God is moving and crafting, then. Then this is what you do. This is how you do that. Then you pray for those who persecute you because he causes the sun to rise on the evil and good, and sends rain on the righteous and the unrighteous. If you love those who love you, what reward will you get? Are not even the tax collectors doing that? And if you greet only your own people, what are you doing more than others? Do not even pagans do that? Be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly father is perfect. And we read that, and we're like, who? I don't have to do any of it. I can't be perfect.
[00:16:50] That's what we do.
[00:16:51] We say, well, if you can't do any of it, I'm not gonna do. If you can't do all of it, I'm not gonna do any of it.
[00:16:57] And that's not what Jesus is saying. You know, I am perfect right now because I live in Jesus Christ through the power of the Holy Spirit. I am. The Bible calls, it says that we are the righteousness of God in Christ Jesus, because we have decided to follow Jesus, because we have decided to live according to his way. It's not because of my strength and my ability to fulfill this. I can't.
[00:17:31] I am unable of my own to do any of this. But it's because I've submitted myself to the work of the spirit in my life that he gives me the strength, he gives me the ability. He reminds me of what Jesus taught so that I could actually try to live it out, and he empowers me to do so.
[00:17:50] And so, in a sense, when Jesus says, be perfect, therefore, as your heavenly father is perfect, he knows what he's saying. He knows that these disciples, on their own, can't do it. But he also knows that in just a few short months, he's going to do something so radical that infills them with himself, his presence, constantly, that they actually could do it.
[00:18:13] They could forgive their enemies.
[00:18:17] They could do what Jesus did. They could. They could live according to his way.
[00:18:23] That's the way christians can heal the world. John the Baptist, one of Jesus contemporaries, a cousin of Jesus, he's sitting in prison, and there's this. He's there because he preached, and he preached something that the ruler didn't like. And he's sitting in prison, and he's starting to wonder. I'm not experiencing the redemption that I thought Jesus was going to bring. And he's wondering if Jesus is the redeemer. And so he sends someone to ask jesus if he's the one, or should we keep waiting? And here's what Jesus reply. I love this. He says, go back and report to John.
[00:18:59] He says, hey, get with the program. John, come on. He doesn't say that. He's like, just tell him this. Tell him what you hear and what you see.
[00:19:09] Tell John what I've said and what I've done. The blind receive sight, the lame walk. Those who have leprosy are cleansed, the deaf hear, the dead are raised, and the good news is proclaimed to the poor. It's happening, John.
[00:19:24] The redemption is taking place through all of these avenues.
[00:19:30] As I speak in churches around the northwest, I am increasingly highlighting what I believe is true for this generation, that I think this generation needs to see the manifest presence of power of God.
[00:19:46] They need to experience who Jesus really is. They need to experience not just what his word says about him. They need to see it in real time through people like you and me living out the way of Jesus. So you know what?
[00:20:02] I'm not worrying any longer whether Jesus heals someone or not. I'm gonna pray for them.
[00:20:09] I'm gonna have the boldness and the courage to step out in faith and live like Jesus. I'm gonna forgive my enemies.
[00:20:18] I'm gonna turn the other cheek. I don't know if it's gonna make a difference. But I do know that if I follow in the way of Jesus, maybe he'll do something and people will be set free and the poor will be, their needs will be met and the lame will walk.
[00:20:35] Not metaphorically, that there is power to be had in the church again.
[00:20:42] And people need to see the presence and power of God in their own lives through people like you and like me. And I just, like, I'm just, like, pressing in. I'm like, jesus, do. Do what you want. Because when they described Jesus, they said it was like a light had dawned.
[00:21:00] It's like the darkness started moving away. It started to move out of the neighborhood, and light started, joy started to come in, freedom started to come in. Life happened again. And isn't that what Jesus does?
[00:21:13] And yeah, there will be times that we're persecuted because of that, but that doesn't mean we should stop or should back away. Let's keep pressing in.
[00:21:26] Now, if now with Jesus, Jesus came writing to display this right now, if the story stopped with Jesus, where he talked, taught the way he taught, did what he did, and if it stopped with the death and resurrection of Jesus, then I could say confidently that the clear answer to the question, does Christianity hurt or heal the world? I can confidently say through the person of Jesus, just looking at the four gospel narratives, the four different authors that wrote about Jesus in the Bible, I could tell you it heals the world.
[00:22:00] The Jesus way heals. I mean, you can't get around it.
[00:22:04] After the resurrection, Jesus appears to his disciples in John, chapter 20.
[00:22:11] And so some of them haven't seen him yet. And so this is kind of their first, like, you know, ta da. Moment, Jesus was dead. Now he's alive. In verse 19, it says, on the evening of that first day of the week, the day that Jesus rose from the dead, when the disciples were together with the doors locked for fear of the jewish leaders, Jesus came and stood among them. And so right there, you're seeing a new body. So he's taken an old body, and he's made it new. Why do we know it's new? Because he can walk through stuff. And I don't know about you, but I can't wait.
[00:22:41] That's the first thing I'm going to do when I get my new body. I'm going to be, like, walking through stuff. I'm like, this is amazing. And I'm a huge matrix guy, so I'm going to fly too. But that's just me. Do what you want, but we're going to have new bodies. It's pretty fun. Anyway, not to the point. Jesus came into there, and he came and he stood among them, and he said, peace be with you. And after he said this, he showed them his hands and his side.
[00:23:08] He shows them hands inside. And the disciples were overjoyed, of course, when they saw the Lord, they're like, you're alive. And again, Jesus said, peace be with you. And I love this. As the father has sent me, I am sending you. And he could have said, as the father sent Abram, I'm sending you. It's similar because God asked Abram to go to a land, and I'm going to bless you to be a blessing. And Jesus is saying, the Father sent me from heaven to earth. I'm going to a place and to a people who will reject me, who may not accept me, and they may not accept Jesus, and they may reject you. But I'm sending you there full of my spirit to do what I did.
[00:23:51] I'm sending you with all authority to do what I did.
[00:23:57] As the father sent me, I'm sending you. And with that, he breathed on them. Seems a little weird, but what's happening here is that it's the breath is.
[00:24:09] Is dissimilar to the spirit of God coming upon you. And so that's. And that's what he does. And with that, he breathed on them and said, receive the Holy Spirit. Now they're going to have the baptism of the Holy Spirit in acts chapter two, where a much larger group of people receive the power of the Holy Spirit. And what Jesus says to them is, be my witnesses.
[00:24:28] And the way that you're going to be my witnesses is I'm going to give you the spirit so that you can live according to, according to my way, so you can be a witness of my goodness, so you can be a witness of my teachings, so you can be a witness of my power. And I'm going to give you the spirit to do that. And so this is kind of a preemptive filling of the Holy Spirit for these few disciples. And so peace be with you. As the father sent me, I'm sending you. And that's through the power of the Holy Spirit. And then he says this. If you forgive anyone's sins, their sins are forgiveness.
[00:25:02] If you don't forgive them, they are not forgiven. I think sometimes we forget the power that we hold in our hands as Christ followers to emulate the way of Jesus. In this very first act of forgiveness, I forgive.
[00:25:20] Before someone ever asks me, there's a verse. I'll finish with this. Just as the son of man did not come to be served, but to serve in the. To give his life as a ransom for many. When do you give your ransom? After you get the person back or before he gave it? Before.
[00:25:42] It's like, I'm going to pay the price before I get the person back.
[00:25:48] Christianity heals. Christians heal. When we lay our lives down as Christ laid down his life for the church, when we love the way we've been loved, when we forgive the way we've been forgiven.
[00:26:04] Ben Nevin and I were talking this past week about how we're just. We're going to be celebrating 70 years as a church later this year. And I was just thinking about all the pastors that I know, the last four or five pastors that I know that were pastoring this church and knowing the stories of, of west side over, I mean, decades. And I can say this with real confidence, that west side has always been a place that redefined faith for people.
[00:26:36] What I mean by that is that, like, you know, people have this idea of what christians are, who Christians are, what they're about, what they're like, who they vote for, all that stuff, right? And then they meet a Westsider, like, and they meet you and they're like, okay, you don't fit.
[00:26:54] You don't, you don't act like you don't I don't understand. And all of a sudden what it does is it creates this disruption in their mind that the Holy Spirit can use.
[00:27:08] You're not like any other christians I've methemeral.
[00:27:15] Now I wish that wasn't true. I wish that didn't happen. I wish that every christian they met was the same.
[00:27:22] But there's something powerful about this place and this people at this particular point in time that you are changing the face of faith for one person at a time over and over. You are just by the way you live, by the way you love, by the way you forgive. It's transformative.
[00:27:43] And listen, there's a day coming, and I can't wait where there will be no more tears, no more pain, no more division, no more sickness when Jesus returns.
[00:27:54] But until then, let's be his hands, his feet, his voice to bring the world a little bit more redemption.
