[00:00:00] Speaker A: From Westside Church in Bend, Oregon, you're listening to behind the message.
Each week we take you behind what we teach here at Westside. I'm your host, Evan Earwicker. Today in the studio, to help us finish up our talk through the book of Philippians, we have our ministry director, Candace Nystrom. Hi, Candice.
[00:00:24] Speaker B: Good morning, everyone.
[00:00:25] Speaker A: And also doctor Brandt Himes, who is our young adults extraordinaire. I can't remember titles all the time. Coordinator, technically, yeah, but a big help in our Philippians study. You put this together with Pastor Dave, and so we've been walking through a lot of your content, Brent, and glad to have you here as we wrap up the book today.
[00:00:48] Speaker C: Great, thank you.
[00:00:50] Speaker A: Today we are talking in Philippians chapter four. It has been six weeks. I can't believe we're at the end already. But we're going to talk about 411 through 13. I want to read this to get us kicked off today. Paul writes, I have learned how to be content with whatever I have. I know how to live on almost nothing or with everything. I have learned the secret of living in every situation, whether it is with a full stomach or empty, with plenty or little. For I can do all things through Christ, who gives me strength.
Another one of Paul's famous passages that I don't know about you guys. I learned this as a kid, right? We memorized, I can do all things through Christ. He gives me strength. And this idea of contentment is core to both Paul's life and his own discipleship in following Jesus as he's been to the very top of society, accomplishment, academic success, political, society wise. He's a roman citizen. He's been to the top. And now here, at the end of his life, towards the end of his life, he's at the very bottom. And what he tells us is, I can be content actually in both places. And I want to talk about this idea a little bit of do we follow after Jesus by just striving for poverty and the loss of things so that somehow we can find contentment? Or is there something else? Is there a peace that we find no matter where we find ourselves, year to year, season to season?
[00:02:19] Speaker C: Yeah, that's good. It makes me think of. So I teach a class on Luke and acts, and we have a topic, the cost of discipleship, where Jesus is calling his disciples and he's asking them to leave everything. And I have students struggle. Well, I don't know if I can be a disciple because I don't think I can hate my family. I don't think I can leave those things. So I'm not sure if I'm ready. And I think what you're getting after and what's happening in that larger context and what Paul's talking about is it's not so much these physical things that we have to renounce everything in order to follow Jesus, but it's a heart posture, and it's responding to the particular things that Jesus is calling us to as we follow him. And that just looks different for different people and different circumstances.
And when Jesus. I think, for me, the heart of following Jesus is discerning and listening and then responding to the particular things that God is calling us to.
And so it's not so much of I have to. If I go into poverty, then I will be a true disciple. Now, Jesus, Jesus might call. Jesus does call some people to that, and that's part of it. But I think to feel like we have to delineate and do these certain things in order to be a disciple, then I think, yeah, we can get distracted from maybe the things that God's really calling us to.
[00:03:55] Speaker A: Candice I think of when Jesus meets with the rich young ruler in the book of John, ends up walking away sad because Jesus does ask him for poverty. That is the cost of discipleship for that young man.
And that speaks to the things that had that young man's heart. Right. Jesus said, not everybody has to give up everything. Right? Cause he hangs out with Lazarus. He hangs out with Joseph of Arimathea. Evidently, there's relationship and closeness with people that doesn't seem like he ever says, get rid of all your stuff. But for this young man, he says, that is the cost. That's what has you. And do you find a connection between either for your own life or those that you minister to? Candace, this connection between things that have our heart and our kind of those barriers to discipleship and falling after Jesus?
[00:04:50] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I think that it's really key. The word Paul used here was, I have learned to be content. You know, it's this process. It's not, oh, I, you know, came to know Jesus, and instantly I had the secret of being content in everything. It's I have learned, meaning he got to experience both sides of things. And I think Jesus, as our teacher, as our father, knows that about us. And he knows, you know, some of us are gonna learn that contentment comes in Christ, not in things and wealth and others of us. That's not the issue. And the contentment comes from experience. Whatever we have to go through in life, to experience. That's the grace, the graciousness of our father. To say, I care more about your heart. I care more about you learning to be content in me. So I'm going to teach you these things. And we all, thankfully, it's not one lesson that applies to all of us. God knows each of us separately. And so I think that that's, you know, what I love about this part that Paul put in here is that key word of I have learned. God has taught me these things.
[00:05:53] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:05:54] Speaker A: Yeah. And reading Paul gives us permission to also be on a journey in following Jesus. Right.
We find ourselves, I think, sometimes frustrated or we feel shame or guilt when we're not there yet. When I do want things I don't have, I do feel like I need something or stuff for my own contentment. When I know, I know the Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want. But I also want, like, a lot. I really want.
And reading Paul through this book in Romans and some other of his core passages remind us, like, oh, yeah, Paul wasn't arrived yet, and we talked about that last week. You know, not that I've already obtained, but I run after and I reach for the prize. And so this sense of journey in contentment, I think, is both a challenge for us to stay on the journey, to keep at it, but also a relief and a comfort and an encouragement to us who feel like I'm just not there. I really like shopping, or I really like stuff.
And I think Paul would say, yeah, I do, too. And we're still pushing after it. Even at the end of his life, I'm still reaching for the prize to hold.
[00:07:10] Speaker C: Yeah, I see.
And I see it in this passage, and I see it in the book as a whole, this centering on Jesus Christ and then working out what that means and what that looks like. We know we've talked about this before and studied it, how the Christ poem in chapter two kind of forms the crux in the center. And I think that lens of who Jesus is and what he's calling us to. And then Paul works that out. And in here, in chapter four, he's talking about learning to be content in the graciousness of God through Jesus Christ. I can do all things, but it's a deeper anchor point of really having to wrestle through. Okay, we can say that Jesus Christ is the center of our lives and of our church, but what does that mean? How do we act?
How do we go through disputes? How do we work out our anxiety and our fears and our unknowns and continually going back to Jesus Christ, I think to me is the theme, Christ at the center. If I had to put a little phrase around it, I would say, and.
[00:08:23] Speaker A: Christ at the center isn't just individual.
He's also speaking a very powerful political statement. In contrast to Caesar being at the top. He said, no, Jesus is actually Lord. He's speaking religiously. Jesus is the messiah that the jewish people have been waiting for. He's speaking corporately into a community, that Jesus is the thing that we come around in community. And so it permeates the Lordship of Christ. At the heart of this letter of the Philippians is that it permeates every level and every layer of our existence and experience as humanity. How does that apply when we're building community, Candice, when we're leaning into gathering people in our churches and in community? And how does this Jesus is Lord permeate those relationships and how we interact and how we engage? And where do we trip up, maybe where do we find these points of tension like Paul has been addressing?
[00:09:24] Speaker B: Well, I think it comes down to what Paul even said earlier in the passage of, I consider it all loss compared to the surpassing value of knowing Jesus. And I think that's a great comparison that he's making, is that we tend to think of kings and lords as unattainable. We can't know them at an intimate level. We just have to bow down to them, follow their rules, operate within their kingdom. And Paul is trying to say, hey, Christ is the ultimate king, but we can know him. And that is the, that's the focus. That's the value, is that we have this king of kings and lord of lords. But he.
He wants us to have this intimate relationship with him. And so he models that first. And that's how we go out into community as well, is not looking at how can I, you know, make this community this thriving, huge, successful thing, but how can I focus on knowing Christ and building my relationship? And that relationship is going to flow out of me and hopefully be expressed in love towards others.
[00:10:28] Speaker A: As we have talked about, even last week, we talked about dealing with anxiety and worry. I know I've received just so many conversations after talking through that with the church. I think it really resonates. People struggle with anxiety. People struggle with worry. People are constantly in the future and just uncertain and scared, for better, lack of a better term, scared of how that's gonna turn out. And so when we talk about this contentment, we talk about peace. Last week, the God of peace. I think this is something that really strikes a chord in people. Candace, have you had conversations? I know you've been teaching this with our women's ministry. And where do you see this, this connection of need when it comes to anxiety and worry and what God offers in peace and contentment, has that resonated?
[00:11:20] Speaker B: Yeah, for sure. I mean, I think it's, you know, like you said, we all have things in our life that are going to cause stress and tension and anxiety. And I don't think that's. Paul's not saying, hey, in order to be a good, mature Christian, you just should have no worries at all.
It's our attitude towards those, are we going to fixate them, on them? Are we going to be distracted by them or are we going to learn to say no? I get to bring my worries, my fears, my stresses, all of that. I bring it to the Lord and ask and invite him to work these out for me and with me and bringing in that attitude of what can I be grateful for in this? Because what we fix our eyes on, right, is what we think about, we bring about. And so if we're just focusing on all the things we're stressed and I don't know how we're going to meet these goals, how we're going to solve these problems that we're encountering, but then we can, it becomes overwhelming. But God's saying, I'm not asking you to solve them. I'm asking you to bring me into it and let me work this out with you. And again, that process of, let me show you the grace, let me show you the patience, let me show you my love.
And as we come to him and say, okay, this thing isn't happening in my life that I want it to. I'm stressed about this, but I can be grateful for these things that are happening right now, and that shifts our mindset. And so it's this, I think, daily surrender, this daily choice to say, I'm going to get up. And yes, I might be stressed and worried of, I don't know how this thing's going to end, but I'm going to every single day practice bringing it to God and let his peace fill me today. Let me trust in him to work this out. And I know when I have done that in my life, it's not like, again, where I just get to throw that anxiety away and it doesn't come back.
It's a constant reminder where I have to come back to the lord. I remember talking to my mentor years ago about an issue I was working through, and I thought we had, you know, I moved past it and learned all the things, and it just kept coming back up into my thought process. And I just said, I'm just so tired of feeling broken. I feel like I have experienced peace with God and this issue before, and yet every year just. It kind of just sneaks up, and I would just want to be done with that. And she just said, you know, your brokenness is not something to.
Just to want to get out of. It's a reminder. It's an invitation from God to remind you that, hey, it's not up to you and your strength to work through this. This brokenness continues to allow me rely on him. And so I think that that's a little bit similar to these anxieties we have. There's stuff that's going to continue to face us in our life.
We're never going to be promised to just find a place to be content for the rest of our days here on earth and never have stress or anxiety. But to be able to say, I'm going to go to God quicker with this each time. I'm not going to fret about this for an entire week before I get to Sunday morning. And then I'm reminded by a sermon, it's every single day, I can go to Jesus and say, I'm struggling with this. I'm going to give to you. And then I find sometimes halfway through the day, I'm like, oh, I've taken it back. I'm gonna give it back to you, God. And it's that relationship of him coming and saying, okay, child, it's okay. Just like you were saying, Evan. A kid going to the parent, the king at night for a glass of water. You know, when my kids were little, it wasn't just one time, mom, can I have a glass of water? Like multiple times for, like an entire hour. Can I have another drink? Can I have another drink? You know, and Jesus is kind of inviting us into that, of, you can come to me every minute if you need to, to say, give me your anxiety and let me fill you with my peace.
[00:14:52] Speaker C: You don't get to bring me in to one of these without me talking about Dietrich Bonhoeffer, of course.
[00:14:56] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:14:57] Speaker C: So I'm reminded about how Dietrich Bonhoeffer, who was a german pastor and theologian and resistance fighter against Hitler in Nazi Germany, he was imprisoned, and when he was in there, he wrote this. He wrote a poem. And it.
I think it gets at this tension that we feel between.
I'm in a really stressful situation, and yet how do I even think about my faith in my discipleship and who God is in the midst of this? And just a few lines from this, he says, who am I? They often tell me I stepped from my cell's confinement calmly, cheerfully, firmly, like a squire from his country house. So there's this idea that he was strong in prison and he was friendly and he was kind, and he had this outwardness. And then he says, or am I only what I know myself? Restless, longing and sick, like a bird in a cage, struggling for breath as though hands were compressing my throat. So the reality is he's just choking with fear and anxiety. And then he ends this poem. He says, who am I, this one or the other? Am I one person today and tomorrow another? Am I both at once a hypocrite before others and before myself, a contemptible, woebegone weakling? There is something within me still, like a beaten army fleeing in disorder from victory already achieved. He says, who am I? They mock me, these lonely questions of mine. Whoever I am, thou knowest, o God, I am thine.
And it's this just profound statement. This is his taking his hand at poetry. He was not a poet, but he's in prison. He's got time to try his hand at poetry. And it's this idea of, I think, kind of holding these, both things together, that in the depths of my anxiety, maybe sometimes I can put on a happy face for people, and that's what they see. But deep down, I feel like I'm just struggling. I'm in this cage. I'm stuck.
And he looks and he says, I'm holding these things, and at the end of the day, I know that I'm God's and that's enough.
And so I think, as we think kind of more broadly about anxiety and about fear and the unknown, part of that is admitting that God's with us in the midst of that, and that we're God's period.
And yeah, there's ways that we engage that and we learn and we look to community to help us experience God's love and grace. But I think we need to know that and just be reminded that we're God's. And Jesus Grace holds us and covers us in the midst of even our anxieties.
[00:18:01] Speaker A: And that's where Bonhoeffer and Paul connect, right? Is that they are in prison and they have lost all things. They don't have access to community directly at this time. And if you can find contentment in Christ there, it's going to work anywhere. It's going to work anywhere. And it is a reminder, I think, for us that if you're having the best time of your life at the peak of success and career and family and whatever you're hoping for in life, and you feel like, I've got it all the stuff, be careful that you don't learn contentment there.
[00:18:37] Speaker C: Right? Yeah.
[00:18:38] Speaker A: That's not the place where contentment is forged necessarily. Nothing wrong with those moments. I hope. People experience blessing in life, but contentment, I think, is forged in those moments where you have to come to grips with, is Jesus enough?
Is he enough with no added comforts when that is the place you find yourself in? I think it is a struggle, right? I think Bonhoeffer is very honestly, as Paul is, sharing how this is not an easy thing to choose. This isn't easy to find contentment in these horrible prison cells, and yet Jesus is here. And so it's the struggle that I think we're invited in on our worst days to say it's not going to be an easy choice. But can I find the contentment that I have in the presence of Jesus on this day? On this day, what are you, Candace, wrestling with or helping?
I think of the women's ministry and teaching through this and with the small groups in the church. And what are you hoping that our church and even those that are listening take away from these themes of handing off worry and finding contentment and keeping Jesus at the center? What does it look like after this, if we really absorb this and take this on and begin to embody what Paul is teaching us in Philippians, how does that change our church and community?
[00:20:13] Speaker B: Well, I am hoping, and I keep telling the women, you know, each week as we unpack this is for them to just see this love for the pursuit of Christ, to abide in him, to understand what that really means, that he wants to be known and that they can pursue that, being so connected to him that the whole rejoice in the Lord always. I think we unpacked this this week. It's not just saying just rejoice always.
We think it does. We think that's what it's saying, that I'm supposed to just find a way to be happy and joyful. But no, it says rejoice in the Lord. And so that's what I hope is that people lean into who is the Lord? How do I rejoice in him? How do I pursue a relationship individually with him? Whether it's understanding the word more, whether it's spending more time in prayer and getting to know Jesus as a real intimate, personal savior, because that's for me, how I've been able to get through, you know, all the trials and struggles and things I've wrestled with is coming back to who is Jesus? And, you know, who I am, that I belong to him. Like you were saying, Brandt, and just really understanding that. I think that Jesus, in his love, uses those things as we go through life. And if we can come to him and say, I don't know how to be redundant. Rejoicing in you right now, Lord, but I want to. I want to rejoice in you. Show me, how do I do that? And he's faithful. He's faithful to show us. And so I hope that our entire body, our whole church, after going through this, just sees Philippians in a new way as an invitation for them, too, that they can. We can all emulate what Paul does. And it's not because Paul was some super guy, you know, just was, you know, granted, with all this amazing awesomeness. It's because he leaned into abiding in Christ. He took God at his word. Jesus said, follow me. Trust in me. I can do this. And Paul said, okay, I'm going to believe you. I'm going to go for it. And so I hope that our congregation says I am going to choose to believe God. I'm going to take him at his word.
[00:22:25] Speaker A: I love how Paul says that. He's discovered this secret in this passage, today's passage, it's him almost saying, hey, come over here. Check out what I just discovered about Christmas.
I wasn't sure of this. I didn't know how this was going to go. But now, in this situation, I've discovered a secret. And it's that you can be content in absolutely the worst places when Jesus is with you. I can do all things through Christ, who gives me strength. That is the secret to contentment, is that anything is possible if Christ is with us.
I think a community that believes that, that really, truly believes that and goes beyond just belief into experiences, the power of that is a world transforming kind of community.
[00:23:18] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:19] Speaker A: You know?
[00:23:19] Speaker C: Yeah, I think so.
For the young adults. We've been studying this as well. And I think one of the takeaways related to that for us that's emerging that I'm seeing emerge is understanding. Yeah, we can do all things through and in Jesus Christ, and then getting a deeper understanding of what that means because of who Christ is and what Christ has done. I think it's easier to think and talk about the lordship of Jesus Christ.
But the thing that Paul does so well is he translates that lordship into the suffering Christ, and spending some time talking about in our studies with the young adults about what does it mean that Christ suffered? Why is that important?
How are we to understand the Lordship of Christ through the lens of him emptying himself and coming and taking on humanity and dying this death, even death on a cross, as we read in Philippians two?
And then what is that invitation for us to help experience and understand that part of the christian life is that kind of entering into that suffering along with Christ and realizing that our identity in Christ is not conditioned on how we're feeling, whether we're triumphing or whether we're suffering, that the identity of Christ is wrapped up in the incarnation.
And, yeah, and I think wrestling with how that looks like in our own lives. What are things that we are being called to maybe give up or give in a way that may not be a full suffering, but maybe giving up a part of something that we're clinging to, that we're trying to control, these things that we find in our daily lives where we're still kind of trying to exert lordship over our own lives instead of giving those things up to Christ?
And so I think, yeah, what's been interesting and helpful for me and the community and our church is hopefully getting this bigger picture of who Jesus is and holding up his resurrection really, truly in light of his suffering and his death and trying to wrestle through what.
[00:25:54] Speaker A: That means at the end of all things. If Paul is here saying Jesus is the top, and because he is, and because he's with me, there's a deep grace that I've found here. And we get the sense of the exaltation of Christ puts Jesus way up high.
It puts Jesus way up high. And yet, in the low places of Paul's experience, he finds a deep, deep well of grace. And I love this idea that from the very top of the universe, where Christ is seated all the way down to the depths and the lowest places of pain and suffering, Jesus is everywhere, all the way through. And sometimes when a well runs dry, what do you do? You gotta keep digging deeper and dig deeper and dig deeper until you find again that water. And I have this sense, I think even pastorally, so many are saying, I want to know Jesus. I want to experience his closeness even in suffering. And sometimes it feels like the well has run dry. And I think my encouragement is, don't look for a different well. Just allow it to be digged, dug deeper and deeper. And deeper into his grace and into his presence, because I know. I know he's there. I know he's found in suffering.
[00:27:16] Speaker C: Yeah.
Yeah. There's something about with Paul and with Bonhoeffer and these.
These prison contexts that help them to identify with the suffering part of the Jesus story in such a profound way. And it's that that really allows them to draw off this deep well that you're talking about. I think because it wasn't that in the lowness of their experience that God was absent, but actually that's where they found God and Jesus in a really meaningful way that taught them this contentment.
[00:27:53] Speaker A: Candace, how do you encourage people?
I think we probably all experienced this where people come to us, whether they're asking for prayer or counsel or encouragement, going through difficulty, or they're facing either relationally or physically sickness, and they're really hurt and saying, I want to pray. I want to believe. I want to have hope that God can come through, but it feels like God is distant. What is the encouragement? When I know I want to promise a good outcome, and I do. I do believe for that. I do pray for that. I believe in healing. And yet we have to also embrace this idea that we can pray for the grace and the closeness of Jesus, even when circumstances don't go right. How do you encourage those that come to you and they're hurting and they want something from Jesus, and yet they feel like maybe their prayers aren't going to work. What does that encouragement look like?
[00:28:52] Speaker B: Yeah, I mean, I think that it's reminding them that Jesus isn't afraid of their pain and their doubt and their uncertainty, that it's not about, hey, you just have to kind of suck it up and just wait for his promises to come through, but that, you know, you can go to God and say, I don't know what to do in this situation. I've been praying and I've been asking and I'm fearful, and that we can invite him into any of that space. We can invite him into the times we're joyful and confident in what he's doing, and we can invite him into those times when we are a hot mess and we can't see. See what's on the other side, and that he's gonna maybe sometimes give us an answer right away, and sometimes he's just gonna sit with us and he's just gonna put his arm around us and say, I'm enough. I'm enough strength for you in this moment and to trust in him. And so sometimes that encouragement is just reminding them of that. If you don't have to have the answer right now, Jesus does. He knows how this is gonna end, and it's in his timing that he's gonna share with you how it's gonna end or how he's gonna solve it. But for me to go and share, you know, I have gone through numerous challenges and times where I have, why, Jesus? Why aren't you answering this? Or why didn't you answer it this way? And. But I continue to lean in and continue to trust what God says and bring my thoughts to him. And sometimes on the other end, I see, wow, you know what? God did answer that, but it was in his timing, and, wow, that was a way better thing than I could have imagined. And sometimes I come around and say, you didn't. He didn't answer it at all like I thought and hoped and prayed for, and that also. Also was good and to give them the encouragement that I haven't gotten all my prayers answered, and yet I still believe and trust in God because he showed up for me in the midst of all of that time and so much so that I can look back on those times of heartbreak and brokenness, of when I really was wrestling with God and wondering, where was he? I can look back and say, gosh, I felt closer to you than I ever have when I was going through that. And that. That, I think, is what is trying to tell us Jesus is the prize. It's not trying to get out of these situations. It's the relationship with Jesus, how we interact with him. And sometimes I almost think, gosh, not that I want struggles and trials in my life, but when I'm not suffering, when I'm not wrestling through things, it's so easy for me to just depend upon myself and my own strengths. But when it is a challenge, it's when I have to go to God and be like, I need you every minute right now. And so that's kind of how I encourage people, is that to lean in, to trust in God. And again, not being afraid of asking him to show us how do we lean in? How do we trust in him?
Because we've all been there.
[00:31:48] Speaker C: Yeah. I think of one of the ways that we experience that, and I think it can be hard for us just culturally, but recognizing that so often the presence of Christ in our lives and in our suffering really comes through the ministry of our community, in the church.
And sometimes coming alongside someone who's feeling alone and is feeling the despair and then just being that presence and maybe they don't realize it in the moment or maybe they realize it later, but that care and compassion and that listening, demonstrating like Jesus is with you. And maybe part of that experience is the community caring for you. And I think as the church, Paul writes this to the church, right.
It's not just an individual plea to do these things and know who Christ is, but it's the church's responsibility to help bring the reality of that presence to each other and to the community.
And I think part of, I mean, Paul talks elsewhere about the body of Christ, like we are called to show the reality and the presence of Christ living today. We talk about, yeah, I think we just experience the presence of Christ when we care and for each other and demonstrate that grace that people can actually experience today through the ministries.
[00:33:29] Speaker B: I think that's so true. I think that it's the whole, we are the hands and feet of Jesus. And so for us, it's also listening to that call of when we get that nudge to check in with someone and give them an encouragement or, hey, I just felt like I was going to spend to pray for you today, or I wanted to drop this off to encourage you today.
I have had that before, too.
And then the person was like, oh, my gosh, I felt God when you did that today because I hadn't told you I was dealing with this, but I was talking to God. And then you showed up with this, or this text came through and, you know, and I think that's also for us to learn to be obedient to that and to follow that call. There's times where I've gotten that nudge and I was like, oh, that sounds crazy. I'm not going to do that. And then, thankfully, the Holy Spirit's faithful. Like, no, you, you should do that.
And that's also how we learn to listen to Jesus, too, is by being those hands and feet to everybody.
[00:34:25] Speaker A: And I would take it further. We're not only the hands and feet, we're the whole body.
Every part of the incarnated Christ is his church. It's us. We are the body of Christ on the earth. And if that's true, and we are filled with the Holy Spirit, just as he was. As we move out and exist in relationship and community and in the world and greater society, we bear the same missional calling that Jesus did. I think our collective hope for the world is the same that Jesus was to seek and save the lost, to redeem all things through, through suffering and the death of our own selves. So that resurrection can come like all that isn't just removed and applies to the historical Jesus at a moment in time that we read about. That now is our story. It's our calling that we are the real presence of Jesus to every hurting person, even as he was, and that that can feel really intimidating.
[00:35:38] Speaker C: Right?
[00:35:38] Speaker A: And we know how imperfect we are at that. And yet somehow that is our. Our vocation. That's our calling, is to be the body of Christ in the world in a real and genuine way that invites real and genuine expressions. You know, and I think many times churches get this reputation well deserved for being very, very transactional, fake, surface level. And I think, man, what would it look like to really allow genuine interactions and honesty to happen in our relationships and conversation?
How would that change how we're able to let people experience healing and grace in their real selves? Not the selves they portray or project, but their real selves, experience something from Jesus, because we've. We've set up and create a community where we're allowing for honesty and genuine expression of love and care and hurt and pain, and all those things can really come out.
[00:36:44] Speaker B: Yeah, we talk about that in women's Bible study when we have our small groups all the time, is we all come to these groups together having some kind of hurting, suffering, question something we're encountering. And the.
The tendency is to come and pretend we have it all put together. You know, especially Tuesday morning Bible study. You know, we're in our, dressed in our best, we're looking cute, we brought some good, yummy food, and we want to come and just portray that we know the Bible and we're just following Jesus. And the thing that we're constantly trying to do is to say, you know, come whether you have it all together or whether you're a hot mess and open up about that. Because likely when I say, here's where I'm really struggling with, someone else in that group is going to say, me too, or, I've been through that. Here's how I got through it. Let me encourage you. And we have this realness, this authenticity that we aren't supposed to just come here and be all put together, that it's this, we're all wrestling through this. We're all learning to lean on the Lord, and we get to be encouraged by hearing each other's true stories. And so that's something we really, really tried to do in our culture, is come as you are, and that can look like whatever is happening that day and know that you're welcome. Because that's what Jesus does, too. I mean, you know, he did not invite everybody to the table that was all put together. He invited the people that were a hot mess and said, I love you, and let's all come around and show you how my grace is enough. And so I think that the more churches can embody that instead of trying to put on this, you know, perfectionist type of thing, you know, and people are looking for that. They want genuineness. They want to see people who are even in the church working for the church, that, hey, yeah, I love Jesus. I believe his word. There are times where I still struggle with this, you know, and it's okay to admit that. It doesn't mean I'm not a close, you know, enough christian to God. It means I'm a human. And we're all going to work all this out together until we are on the other side with Jesus.
[00:38:54] Speaker A: And that's good news for everybody who struggles or feels like they're not enough. It's good news for me. I haven't looked cute since 92, you know, so I feel like, okay, I'm in good company, I guess, with those, feel like they're a hot mess. Could we create a community in a church that is not for people that are a mess, but is of the people who are a mess?
And that goes from the first time person who is, who knows very well how much they're struggling all the way to us as leaders, saying, we know what it is to struggle. And we do struggle. And we are here together offering ourselves up to the grace of Jesus because we need it every single day before we close, Brant, I know there's a Bonhoeffer movie coming out from Angel Studios, the makers of the chosen. You are actually on that team creating the content for the curriculum, rather, for the kind of companion materials that are going to come out after the movie premieres. Want to say anything about that?
[00:40:01] Speaker C: Yeah, it's great. It's going to be an eight week Bonhoeffer course. It's focusing on more of the thought and some of the theology of Bonhoeffer. We're going to get the life of Bonhoeffer from the film.
It's a great film. I got to preview it. I'm really excited about it. I had this sense when I watched. So I'm a Bonhoeffer scholar. I've studied Bonhoeffer a lot. And when I watched the preview, I had a sense of, oh, here's the person that I've been imagining in my head for the last 15 years. And he's saying and acting and doing things that I pictured him doing. So it was kind of a relief, actually, that, yeah, I think the film does a great job of portraying the life.
And in this course, it's geared towards churches. So the hope is that churches will have opportunities to create small groups and studies for eight weeks. And really getting into Bonhoeffer, how his theology connects with what he's going through in his life. And so it traces his biography through his theology and through his writing.
I think it's exciting. I'm in the midst of writing it and recording lectures. I'm very excited for that to come out.
[00:41:19] Speaker A: That's great. And the name of the film is Bonhoeffer.
[00:41:21] Speaker C: It's Bonhoeffer. Yeah.
[00:41:22] Speaker A: So be on the lookout for that. Thank you for walking through the book of Philippians with us. If you've listened all six weeks, we sure appreciate you coming along. Our messages from the weekends
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